Where did the sobriquet or title “godfather” come from?
I have a lot of godchildren and I love the movie. That is my number one movie in the world. I believe the greatest movie ever made- ‘the godfather’. I watch it the way you read news and the way you read a newspaper. For me, it is like a duty. There is a combination of that somewhere along the line.
I have a lot of godchildren. And the last I counted, it was 32. My first godchild is in the UK now. She’s doing her PhD in Engineering and the last is less than six months.
And when you are with younger people, sometimes, they have a problem with calling you by your name. I’m sure some somewhere from somehow the two merged.
It means it has nothing to do with being the Mafia, the kind we have in Sicily?
No. I am a Pyrate.
That’s Seadog?
Yes. I am a Seadog.
Can I ask you about the recent thing that happened in Lagos when the Pyrates sang a controversial song about Tinubu?
What’s the big deal? If you check the way PC was formed, it wasn’t formed to do things the normal way. It’s a non-conformist association to do things differently. So, if some people decided to sing, you will ask yourself what is the lie in the song? What is immoral in that song? It’s not for anybody to start to get upset or get defensive about what happened. I have no apology whatsoever even though I was not there. I have no apologies whatsoever to render to anybody because the song was predicated on a fact. Tinubu said emi lokan, right? Tinubu is shaking. He has Parkinson’s disease. Is it not? Tinubu is old. Is he not. Did they call Tinubu a thief in that song? Did they call him a rapist or an amorous person or a drug dealer or a drug user? They stated things that are in the public domain. So, why should it be an issue? People should laugh over it. People should just see it as one of those things.
Fela called Obasanjo a thief, called Abiola a thief. Which one is worse? Calling the man a thief, ITT, International Thief Thief; Yar’Adua, see him neck like ostrich. Obasanjo dey there with him big fat stomach. Fela did all that. I don’t see anything wrong. If they had said something that is not a fact, then I can now begin to have an issue to think about.
Anybody who knows PC knows that you go to a club house on Friday evenings, you hear all kinds of songs. We abuse ourselves. It doesn’t matter if you’re a Pyrate or not. It’s like the last national converge. The song that got the award was the one on ‘Honourable, Honourable, Off Your Mic.’ That was the song that took the award in the converge. Why didn’t people raise hell then? What’s the difference? The most important thing is that the song was based on facts, not what they heard. It’s what every Nigerian has seen.
You have this Facebook Awards. What is it all about?
It is still within the context of trying to encourage people to do things right. If you realise that somebody was being recognized and promoted because of the way he conducted himself in public, you might be inspired. Every Nigerian wants to be seen as the person of the moment. You know we like show very much. So, what we tried to do was not to do the regular type of thing where people will just sit down somewhere and say this person don get award. We made it open. Anybody who won eventually was picked from the Facebook Family. Nominations of the first ten will now be put to another scrutiny. And we now bring people, who were known people and are active on Facebook to become an electoral college. Among them, they would vote for the best. And the first time me or any other person would know the winner is when the chairman announces the winner. The last one, the person who announced it, who did the collation was in Liverpool. So, there was no possibility of anybody influencing the result one way or the other. One, I said is that let that person be a role model. Anybody that wins the Facebook award must be a role model.
If you come to Facebook to abuse people: Wike is a thief; Rotimi is a fool; Magnus is a bastard, you cannot be a true model of any person growing up.
Apart from being able to write well, you must conduct yourself well. All the people who had won it, there was no dispute. It is only the last one, the person who came second was not there. So I now said that that thing Nigerians do, I am not going to encourage it. If you are nominated in an award, you try and be there. It is a way of establishing some level of discipline in the system. If you see like Grammy or Oscar you can never have a Award and they will nominate somebody and they will say the winner is not there. It’s not possible. But in Nigeria, except the ones that are packaged, they will not be there. If you don’t turn up, you don’t deserve to be second. If you are voted second, we’ll jump to the next person who came third.
Is the award open to every Facebook user?
Everybody. The process is this. We just call for nominations for those who are on Facebook to nominate people that they think deserve to be models on Facebook. You will now nominate a hundred. We will then look at the ones that have multiple nominations. From there we will take the first 30 who will now be voted for the best 10. It is from that 10 that they will hand over to an electoral college, from where the winner is selected. Everything is done on Facebook.
I can understand your passion about Port Harcourt. But it’s like the city is not playing the international roles that it should like hosting international tournaments and shows…
You are correct. Why that is not happening is because some people did us in. There was a time there was agitation for oil companies to relocate their headquarters back to the region. I was part of that campaign. It was called the Charles Webber Collective in memory of one of our friends, Charles Webber. We campaigned that banks that did business, that any bank that the bulk of our allocation was going to in Rivers State, must either fully relocate to Port Harcourt or have their regional office in Port Harcourt; that staff are recruited from there. And that’s not a situation where you are a manager in Lagos and you are transferred to Port Harcourt and you come to Port Harcourt with your driver and your personal staff or cook. We even made the move that Rivers State Government should convert one of the banks. We knew Rivers State Government was virtually surviving FinBank. Why don’t you convert to Rivers State Government-owned bank and tell FinBank, relocate. Even if are not going to make it Rivers State Government-owned, tell them to relocate their headquarters to Port Harcourt.
So, in the course of all that something dramatic happened. You know the first four Americans that were kidnapped that opened up the Pandora’s box of kidnapping? When they were kidnapped, Ijaw Youths Council (IYC) set up a committee to investigate the kidnap because it was new and strange. And it was at the same time at the height of agitation by IYC. So, they didn’t want their image to be tarnished. One of the members of the committee told me they found out some startling facts. One, that all the people that were involved in that kidnap were Ijaw boys. But not any of them lived here in the region. None of them was even born here in the region. They were all born and they grew up in Lagos and they came here from Lagos to come and carry out the operation.
Secondly, the warehouse where they kept the four Americans was hired by an office which was traced to Lagos. The office that funded the hiring of the warehouse where they kept the four Americans was in Lagos. So it was a Lagos funded and activated crime.
The other thing is that did someone from Rivers State or Port Harcourt go there to go and plan from there? The likely answer is none. What was the implication of that? When it happened money changed hands. So, it’s possible that the same boys now decided to come and open that business as a franchise. Maybe, some other people got to know how profitable the business had become and started doing it. It became a crime that was profitable. The agitation for oil companies to come to the region died immediately because it was no longer logical because the expatriates were no longer safe. They were picking them everyday like the way you pick periwinkle. But again, it is instructive to know that at this point in time Calabar was still very quiet; calm, clean amiable city; slow maybe, but a kind of place expatriates will like to be. Uyo was still there. Eket was still there. But ‘no,’ they all moved to Lagos.
Before, if you go to G.R.A., Aba Road, you’d see White men, expatriates walking freely in the evenings; Old G.R.A., New G.R.A., everywhere. That thing had a trickling down effect on social life. But most of the lounges where people went to in the evenings, were primarily targeting the expatriates because left to us, we would just go to booze, go clubbing. But the pubs, the lounges were the expatriates’ thing. And that culture that it’s now 5 O’Clock, we don go Toby Jog, Chess Bar and all of these places, and you are there all evening during the week. Before, we had to wait till the weekend before we go to the club. But now, every evening somewhere to go and hang out and not procreate unnecessarily.
So, when all these places died, Oyibo run leave us. Port Harcourt died. The biggest headache we have in Port Harcourt today, is the absence of commerce. As long as people don’t have something gainful they are doing, the crime rate will not drop. And that’s why politicians will continue to take Rivers people for a ride because they are the only people who have access to money and they dictate the terms of endearment in the town. And that’s what has destroyed Port Harcourt. People don’t have any independence of thought any longer because “I cannot speak without getting worried about what my leader would say.”
All the warehouses in Trans-Amadi have become churches. No system ever in this world will grow where people go to church more than they go to work.
Can anything be done about it?
It’s all about confidence. But unfortunately politicians have cashed in on it. Instead of diffusing the tension, they are creating more tension that is making it look like we as a people are very combative, that we like to fight. When I was in law school we didn’t have money. But, people who had cars wanted to be seen with Port Harcourt people because na we get groove. But now when you say you are from Port Harcourt the first thing they say is that you are a militant, kidnapper, a fighter and all of that. So, until we begin to have a leadership in the state that consciously deliberately decides to create commerce.
And how do you do it? It’s by making the system, the environment conducive for business to thrive. Business cannot thrive where the political leadership is always fighting, shouting, creating an impression in the head of the people that the place is unstable. Who wants to do business in a place where people are fighting? Nobody. Our governor is talking here, he talks like there’s war tomorrow morning. There is no encouraging, no soothing message.
Everybody is messed up in the state. This is one state that doesn’t have big men. They are all poor. They don’t want to say something that will annoy Wike. The other ones do not want to say something that will annoy Rotimi. So, anything Wike says is correct, anything Rotimi says is correct. Nobody will say, stop that. Don’t do that. There is no single man in this state who has the financial muscle to summon Wike to his house. When Amaechi is feeding them, Wike is feeding them, who will have the courage?
That’s the biggest problem we have in our state. All our chiefs are as useless as the politicians. It’s instructive to see that our traditional institutions have degenerated to the level where the governor said stuff about a chief. But the one that is most profound is the one he said, “where is the Amanyanabo of Opobo. “Is he here?” Him dey raise him hand.” Throughout that drama, the Amanyanabo of Bonny did not move. No emotion whatsoever, just to let you know that he was disgusted. But the bulk of the traditional rulers were laughing and clapping. A whole Amayanabo of Opobo, was asked to raise his hand, and he too raised his hands. Can you imagine a situation where (Governor Godwin) Obaseki (of Edo State) will say, ‘Where’s the Oba of Benin? Is he there?’ Or may be the Asagba of Asaba. Governor Okowa would say, ‘Is Asagba here?’ Is he blind wey him no go see Asagba? Did Wike say he did not see Amanyanabo there?
My traditional ruler here had problem with Wike. He was pro-APC, So at one point, Wike tried to remove him. He said, well you can remove the title and withdraw the recognition as First Class Traditional Ruler of Rivers State but you cannot remove me as the Nyeweli Akpor. That animosity remained until when the man died, Wike went there to bundle him to the mortuary that it was COVID-19. Bundled him straight to the cemetery and poured concrete on it.
What is your own take on restructuring or devolution of power?
Those are lazy talks. The truth about the matter is, opposition is loudest when you are far away from power. As these people are shouting restructuring, the moment they get to power you will not hear them talk about restructuring. By then, the system is working well for them. What are you restructuring? Tell me how you want to restructure Nigeria. I have challenged anybody who wants, to have a debate – tell me along what line you are going to restructure South/North? Are you only going to devolve power from the president? What about governors to local government? The problem we have is that the institutions are weak. So, everything must be done to strengthen the institutions such that, there will be consequences for actions people take in this country. There is no country where you will not find criminals, no country where you will not find people that have the mindset of doing evil. But, the difference between those countries and ours is this, the citizens are fully aware that if they do something the law will come after them and they will pay for it. But in Nigeria, I’m going to refer you to this guy called Sabinus (he does skits), he said, ‘Now I go go village go sell one of our lands. When I sell the land N10million I go keep N2million for police, I go now keep N1million for lawyer, take N1million go native doctor, then I go come take some flex.
You know why that is instructive? He has decided to violate the laws of the community and he has what to use to shield himself. So for him, there are no consequences, all he needs is money. Do you think for one second that another Nigerian will allow himself get involved in something to what Ike Ekweremadu is going through today? If you don’t know me, I know that Ekweremadu is not involved in anything truly – truly illegal. The only thing that is holding him down is that the law in the United Kingdom insists that kidney, human parts and organ donation is totally free. It’s not to be induced either by human threat. Now, what is holding Ekweremadu down is that he has admitted to the fact that the guy was negotiated with and paid, not that Ekweremadu was involved in illegal harvesting of human part but, it is the commercialization of the donation that is the problem. But you see, if not for donation that is the problem, you see if na for Nigeria now dem say im won carry knife cut the boy, the matter will just die because I know that my late elder brother had kidney issues and they had to get somebody who we paid to travel with him to India. Even India, you pay bribe (you know India is like Nigeria) for them to accept the guy because they felt there is no relationship between him and the donor. They felt it was commercial because they knew it was commercial but, India is like Nigeria and they were paid-off.
Oyibo get reason wey they do those things because taking something into a foreign body, maybe it has a long term effect. For the moment you may feel you are okay; that is why those who go for kidney and organ things in United Kingdom and America they come feeling they are normal. Go and check their record, they don’t last long. So, when you talk about restructuring, what you should be talking about is to restructure your mind and made to be more disciplined and obey the laws of Nigeria. That is what will make this country to function- obey the existing laws.
Our existing laws are more than enough and sufficient but the problem is that we just need to obey the existing laws of the country.
Are you Obidient or Atikulated? There is this trend now….
Okay, let me put it this way, the emergence of Tinubu was a carefully crafted project by the North that power returns to the North because they know Tinubu is going to have problems- one, his age, his health and religion. They knew there was no way Tinubu will sell. So, any option he chooses, is going to be bad for him. Like they say, it was the devil’s alternative because, if they have chosen a Christian northerner, they will say that there is no northern interest in APC ticket. Now, choosing a Muslim, they are saying there is no Christian in the North. But, for you to be vice president, you are qualified to be president so any which way you look at it, is a bad sell and the suddenness(with which) Tinubu became the overwhelming candidate of the party to the extent he got the votes that he got against Rotimi Amaechi, you can never imagine that at some point, when they threw up Lawan and they looked at the next person, I am not too sure that the presidency was much involved in Atiku dropping Wike as running mate. So, it is a combination of a reality which is that the North does not want power to come back to the south because of the experience they had with Jonathan. Because, they felt that if these south people get power, if the situation was as of today, they would not have done to Obasanjo what they did for him in 1999. So, when you try to compare them (Obasanjo and Odili). Odili had bought everybody in PDP and the North saw him as more accommodating and the person they could do business with, than what Obasanjo did for them for eight years, despite the fact that he was not popular in the West. I was talking with some people and I told them one of the things Obasanjo did when he was in power, he ordered that NPA (Nigeria Ports Authority) should go back to Lagos; that where is the water in Abuja, that the headquarters of NPA would be in Abuja?
So, at that time, I knew that Nigeria was getting the highest quantum of crude oil; we had the highest production of crude oil in Lagos, Ibadan, Ondo and Ekiti and Osogbo and the headquarters is in Lagos for NNPC to remain in Lagos, it means that oil is coming from Lagos. We suffer from some form of inferiority complex that is why people will say the environmental strides in Lagos is the ingenuity of the political leadership. It is not true.
Tinubu did no jack (work) for eight years as governor of Lagos State. Come and show me one thing that Tinubu did, I want to see it oh! He increased revenue base of Lagos and we don’t see the money in the streets like primary schools built, health centres built. Where are they? You go to Lagos today, there are some landmark things you will see that happened in the democracy. If you say Fashola and Ambode, Tinubu did nothing. What Tinubu did is to acquire the whole of Lagos but, he created the impression as if Lagos is a model state.
Let me give you a practical example, you know the Ikoyi link bridge, the Ikoyi/Lekki link bridge and Woji Bridge in Port Harcourt, which one is longer? What you ask yourself is very simple how many pillars that Woji has and how many pillars Ikoyi bridge has aesthetics if you have four holding the bridge in Lagos and have four at different places holding the bridge in Port Harcourt, at the end of the day, Woji bridge is far more.
Rotimi did much more than that. Is it the primary, secondary and health centres he built all over the state, where is that in Lagos? They know a lot of people talk about Wike bridges, he is stealing money, okay fine. No problem when he is going next year, is he going with those bridges? They are there forever except the world we are in now tomorrow somebody will bomb those things. But as long as those bridges remain there, they have changed the face of the urban look of Port Harcourt.
Let me tell you something that you might just go home and think about. Do you remember the level of tension at the peak of construction in Port Harcourt and Obio/Akpor? Everybody was angry in this town but, now if I’m going to GRA, maximum 30 minutes and I’m in Government House you don’t have anything like that in Lagos. Lagos is still the Lagos that the military built with our money. Third Mainland Bridge was built with World Bank loan, East-West road they are building it from the budget; who does that? The Third Mainland bridge was built with World Bank loan but, our East-West road dey for budget under Ministry of Niger Delta Affairs so, the government of Nigeria has been wicked because of our self-inflicted hate for ourselves.
We are not looking at the pain outsiders are inflicting on us. Before now, if I am going to GRA it will take me up to three hours. For instance, if I am going to Yenagoa, it will take me like an hour 30 minutes but, in our psyche. it is close. While Lagos is built with our money making the journey look short, it is not short, it is our money that makes it look short and making them look like miracle workers. Lagos has the worst set of roads in Nigeria that I know of. I am talking about big roads where standards are so poor. The only road project Tinubu started for eight years was Epe Express and who did it? Hitech. Who owns Hitech, Tinubu. That is where Wike got his model; that is why EFCC can’t trace his money. All the money he makes goes into property acquisition. When you give Julius Berger N10billion contract, you get back N5billion and build a property somewhere. He used one Shell company and owned the property and the documents are with him.
So, on ASUU strike what do you have to say?
When they want to do accreditation, they will write and accreditation team will come. Before they come, they will go with a different team and lease their facilities and come and equip the place, in case of sporting facility and say the place is very equipped and after they leave the owner of the place will collect their money and the facility. Who is responsible for the poor treatment of the team because you have built something on lies? Unsustainable lies, poor funding from the government and when government say they want to do accreditation you see everything in place. So, what happens when they are gone? What kind of a system, what kind of human beings would run an association where every year you go on strike for four or five months? Now watch it, I don’t know where this one will be different, whether they are going to fight this thing till the end and get everything fine. But another ASUU leadership will look for another thing that they will go on strike for.
The basic thing Nigerians don’t know is that Nigeria is a poor country and we are acting as if we are rich what do you produce? Nothing! What do you produce, I am asking you? Nothing. Look at toothpick, you can’t produce. They import everything basically; as you are importing so your import billing is rising. Do you want to have a strategic reserve? And how do you know a country that is rich? Their external reserve. Once you are unable to fund your import, it is a problem. If you cannot balance your needs, there is a problem. We don’t produce anything in this country. I know for a fact that Nigeria today is the highest producer of rice in Africa but, we don’t eat it, because it is not fine like long grain from Thailand. But go and ask any nutritionist or doctor, they will tell you our rice is good because the foreign rice have been there for three, four, five years and something has been put there to make sure that it doesn’t go bad. That preservative is it good for your health? You see people from 30 – 35, 40 years having kidney failure, it is because of what we are eating. We are eating what we don’t even know.
Inflation has risen to 21 per cent but it has dropped in the North-West and North-East. Go and check NBS Nigeria Bureau of Statistics site. While the rest of Nigeria inflation is rising, it is dropping in the so called war front area, you know why? They produce what they eat, we eat what others produce. Now food cannot be expensive in the North, you produce and I produce, who will buy from each other? So the only thing you do is to find a way to send it out and everybody is grooving. Ask yourself, you said you are from Eleme, Eleme used to be food basket of Rivers State. Drive along that road as if you are going to Calabar, what do you see? Na garri wey dem carry for North come. When did they start selling garri that comes from the North? They start selling dry fish that comes from the North to us. You know when you look, the only thing that you see from here is water and vegetable, everything comes from the North-pepper, tomato, groundnut oil, garri, beans come from the North except plantain that Ijaw people give us. Growing up to know a poor man, you see him eating iced fish or cow meat? How? Everybody had fresh fish, dry fish, chicken and chicken was not an everyday thing but other things like dry fish and fresh fish. If you check the whole of this place, you will not see anybody that goes fishing. Most of the people that come to Choba to sell fish are Hausa people.
A lot has been said about the governorship of Rivers State and it has been a high expectation on the part of people. While at the center citizens are saying they are Obidient but in Rivers State we have 18 registered political parties and all of these political parties do have their candidates. Who are the candidates of these political parties vying for the governorship seat? The point I am trying to make here is that there are three political parties running elections in Rivers State, any other thing anybody is talking is living in denial. PDP, APC and SDP- SDP is because of Magnus, he won’t win, no doubt about it.
Why?
He does not have the structure to win election. The battle is between APC and PDP that’s all. You think politics is magic? In Kenya’s election it was a battle between Odinga and Ohuru not Ruto. Who is Ruto? Elections in Kenya over the years have been between the two families, the only person that broke that, is Akpoi.
What will be your advice for Rivers people on the choice of governor?
It is difficult to advise Rivers people, you know why? You can’t advise Rivers people on good governance because they are comfortable in the state of bad governance. You know what is suffer syndrome? It’s when the victim is comfortable with that situation. You are a slave, you are happy being a slave and when I talk about Rivers politics, it is restricted to PDP even APC. I was telling some young men, go back and read the story of Rivers State. Nobody involved in the agitation in the creation of Rivers State immediately after the civil war that was in government from 1960 was in his 50s. They were all in their late 30s. others were in their early 40s. Only people like J. D Orike, Oriji, Igbeta, Harold Dappa Biriye; those were the people that were in their late 40s and 50s. Nabo (Douglas) was the first Senior Advocate of Nigeria (SAN) because the western press has made it look like Rotimi Williams was the first SAN.
The point I am making, the Rivers people have not decided that they want good governance; when they decide that they want good governance that will help shape their opinion on the ways political parties get leaders. We need to define what good governance is. Look, anybody can award contract but not everybody can plan. I grew up in a state where we used to have 10 years and 20 years development plan. When last did you see Rivers State budget? People don’t care, so what will be the basis on who will govern them? If you don’t have access to performance indication, how will you judge? Now Rotimi or Wike wakes up and announces construction of road, which budget and which Assembly debated on it and approved it? But you just go and say flyover here, when did you make that presentation to the Assembly?, when did they debate and when did they approve it? So, these are the issues that Rivers people need to ask themselves about. Do we really want good governance assuming they now know what good governance is? It is when that is done that we can start talking about wanting a right person to rule us. Right now it is sentiment of where you come from and all that. I hear people making noise about Wike doing projects in Obio/Akpor and PHALGA, how many Obio/Akpor people get motor? What is the business between Obio/Akpor people and roads development benefit? Me, just the way it benefits you, we are talking about a local government where less than 30 per cent are indigenes, the rest are outsiders. If he was building housing estate like Okilo did and gave it all to Ijaw people but until then, Wike is doing his business because that is the only way he can make money for himself. I know for sure that if military government comes now which is impossible, to take over, Wike no go see sun. By the time army slaps him, he will bring out all the monies in his custody and the military is careless about due process. But, in civilian rule, they will bring documents like bill of quantity to prove their point. Again, as I said, he could have probably stolen all the monies and done nothing and nothing will happen. Things are docile to the point that people don’t care. So, don’t ask my advice for Rivers people because they don’t need my advice. If they need my advice, how can they be talking about Tonye Cole and Sim Fubara or Sim and Magnus how? If it is between Magnus and Tonye that would have been fine. Where you need to look at what you have done before you have become Assembly member, commissioner, secretary to the state government and a senator and Tonye Cole, even if he is not experienced in politics, he has run a successful business, one of the biggest oil and gas companies in Nigeria. You can begin to see that he has an idea of what to do-he understands budget, governance and has tried processes. Sim only has been an accountant in Government House and is somebody who is wanted by the EFCC, that is his profile.
Governance has been reduced in Nigeria to be just federal and state and the closest form of government which is the local government is not functioning properly.
The local government administration should be scrapped. It is of no use and there is nothing you can do about it. Do you know the problem we have in this country? The federal government of Nigeria has no business with both the creation and sustenance of local governments. Local government is an exclusive responsibility of state government whether they want it or they don’t want it the world over. It is only in Nigeria that the constitution will give federal government the right to create local governments and now put them at the level of sharing money with both the federal and states, where else does that operate? And when you do that you now say the local government system should now be managed and the party that conducted local government election takes all the seats. So, either they scrap it, keep them at the level, just as the federal government cannot determine how the state runs, states should not interfere with how the local governments are run. Now most local governments have become feeder pillars for the states.
